Definately the most important aspect to any job is client education. Never assume they know anytrhing about what we do, even if they claim to. Like Stu said, the majority of people think that etch marks are stains. And although you may verbally explain it and think they understand, have it in writing so that you know they understand. Plenty of times i have explained something as simple as what is a stain and what isnt, but when the job is being done it is as if they forgot our entire conversation..."Oh so these spots can happen again?" Gotta love what we do. So long story short i agree with Stu, if they want it sealed i think you should seal it but make sure they understand what the sealer protects against ad what cant be prevented.

Sent from my Verizon Wireless BlackBerry

From: stuart rosen <mail@stoneshine.com>
Sender: rosen.stuart@gmail.com
Date: Wed, 4 Aug 2010 23:15:56 -0400
To: Restoration and Maintenance<sccpartners@stoneandtilepros.com>
ReplyTo: "Restoration and Maintenance" <sccpartners@stoneandtilepros.com>
Subject: RE: [sccpartners] black marble/ color enhancing sealer?

Barry-how bad a condition are these walls in anyway.Are you going to hone and repolish
the walls. I just looked at some commercial bathrooms in nyc.fancy place with polished st. laurant bathrooms. They were trashed(not one stain) (9000 etches) - managemant wanted to repolish and seal.(what would stain a wall in a fancy bathroom anyway?)
I told them I would do whatever they wanted but they might as well book me in advance monthly to keep those areas polished. I suggeted they hone the bathrooms and color enhance them. It made big sense to them. If your customers bathrooms are in that bad a shape and the stone would look good color enhanced, it may be a possibility. If you seal the walls and they get etched again or whatever your customer may want to have you redo them because he thinks the sealer failed. I feel it is better to educate them to the fact they spec'd out the wrong material for a bathroom period.
 
And theres more!,
I just honed and polished a large area of bottocino walls soiled from air pollution,smoke,and some paint.
We were able to restore the walls removing all the soils and polishing to a high luster.
The client wanted to seal the walls which we tested for porosity.We found that using a wet towel, spray bottle and short of bring in the fire department we couldn't get that wall to absorb a drop. I informed the client that he didnt need to seal these walls. It took a bit to explain to him that after many years of accumulated soils on that wall it was only on the surface. I also believed that if these walls had been sealed from the beginning without proper maintenance it would have been just as soiled. I have worked on a lot of bottocino new and old, walls and floors(polished and honed) and cant remember one stain that had to be poulticed out.
Isnt it true that bottocino is very dense and when polished the amount of sealer it would absorb is negligible. Consider this stone on a wall in a lobby and think about what stainig agents could stain this wall. 
I told him it was more important to develop a routine in house maintenance program regarding the walls on say a quarterly basis.
They agreed.
I realize that I could have probably made some extra bucks by telling them it had to be sealed. 
What troubles me is if they did some simple research on the web they could possibly consider that I conned them on the sealing job. I couldn't sell myself on sealing their walls and many others I could have sealed as well but didn't.
I have a friend of mine who is a fabricator and he seals everything in sight. He could care less if it is porous or not. We talk about this from time to time and he doesnt care about the science behind sealing. I have done four or five sealer removal jobs for him. He specializes in sealing black absolute. I did one not too long ago removed alot of sealer from black absolute, had a whole conversation(with the homeowner) about sealing stones that aren't porous.
Wouldn't you know as we were packing up the homeowner wanted to know if we were sealing it before we left.
So someone please tell me do we seal everything in sight and charge for it or do we approach this in a logical scientific way based on the requirements of every individual stone.
Our customers pay alot for our services and most of us have survived though tough economic times.
Dont we owe our customers a square deal. 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
On Wed, Aug 4, 2010 at 3:59 PM, John Freitag <jfreitag@thestoneandtileschool.com> wrote:

Barry,

 

There are some that feel by sealing a polished  stone it will not do anything to protect it, however I somewhat disagree with that thought process. If you have a stone that is honed or polished you still have open pores within the stone, even if they are small pores they will still allow the sealer to penetrate the stone thus giving you an extended time clean up the spill. In the restroom case sealing won’t help much but every little bit will help..

I would still seal the stone with a solvent based sealer.

 

 

John E. Freitag

President/Director

The Stone and Tile School

Office 407-567-7652

Cell 407-615-0134

jfreitag@thestoneandtileschool.com

 

schoollogo

 

www.thestoneandtileschool.com

 

 

 

 

 

From: rosen.stuart@gmail.com [mailto:rosen.stuart@gmail.com] On Behalf Of stuart rosen
Sent: Sunday, August 01, 2010 11:38 PM
To: Restoration and Maintenance
Subject: RE: [sccpartners] black marble/ color enhancing sealer?

 

Hi Barry,

polished black marble on a wall once restored and properly maintained will not need to be sealed.A sealer only does one thing protect the stone against true staining agents for a period of time. True stains will always be darker than the stone and etch marks will always be lighter than the stone. Black marble in an active public restroom could have the potential for lots of etching issues. Sealing with an impregnator will do nothing to help your customers situation.

Unless it is honed and you would like to color enhance the surface there isnt much you can do to protect it other than coat it in epoxy(you dont want to do that)

If you tell us what your customer wants to accomplish these guys and gals will offer you up some sound advice.  

If you want clarification on sealers just ask I bet you get a good amount of great replies.

On Sun, Aug 1, 2010 at 10:04 PM, Barry Raduta <barry@diamondstoneandtilecare.com> wrote:

i'll make the question simple; what sealer would you recommend?  water-based, poly or color enhancing?  i really don't understand the subtle differences between sealers and i would appreciate your collective help
thanks......barry

 

On Sun, Aug 1, 2010 at 3:15 PM, Fred Hueston <fhueston@gmail.com> wrote:

nope..wont provide any protection at all

 

On Sun, Aug 1, 2010 at 3:05 PM, <flooramor@aim.com> wrote:

Protection against what?

J

From: Barry Raduta <barry@diamondstoneandtilecare.com>

Date: Sun, 1 Aug 2010 15:04:19 -0400

To: Restoration and Maintenance<sccpartners@stoneandtilepros.com>

ReplyTo: "Restoration and Maintenance" <sccpartners@stoneandtilepros.com>

Subject: [sccpartners] black marble/ color enhancing sealer?

 

Hi folks,

would you recommend using color enhancing sealer on a black marble wall in a public restroom after restoration.  would it provide the most protection in this type of environment?

thanks.......barry

--
Thank You,
Barry V Raduta
Diamond Stone & Tile Care
215-816-7689

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--

Frederick M. Hueston PhD
www.stoneforensics.com

www.stoneandtilepros.com
Recommended stone care products  http://www.stonecarecentral.com/?Click=2149

Many of my informational articles can be found at www.thestonedude.blogspot.com

Listen to my radio show at www.blogtalkradio.com/drfred

888-314-9077
702-314-1017




--
Thank You,
Barry V Raduta
Diamond Stone & Tile Care
215-816-7689

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Regards,
Stu Rosen
201-446-1200
www.mbstonecare.com
www.stoneshine.com
"A posse ad esse "

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--
Regards,
Stu Rosen
201-446-1200
www.mbstonecare.com
www.stoneshine.com
"A posse ad esse "

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